Dentistry Uncensored with Howard Farran
Dentistry Uncensored with Howard Farran
How to perform dentistry faster, easier, higher in quality and lower in cost.
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1251 The Joy of Giving Away Dentistry with Dr. Brady Smith : Dentistry Uncensored with Howard Farran

1251 The Joy of Giving Away Dentistry with Dr. Brady Smith : Dentistry Uncensored with Howard Farran

9/18/2019 6:00:00 AM   |   Comments: 0   |   Views: 41
Dr. Brady Smith is a general dentist and graduated from The University of Pacific in 2009 in the top seven-eighths of his class. Right out of school he purchased a Comfort Dental franchise in Pueblo, CO. He now owns and operates two successful Comfort Dental franchises in Vancouver, WA that he started from scratch in 2014 and 2016. Both practices grew quickly and now produce 1.8-2M a piece annually.

VIDEO - DUwHF #1251 - Brady Smith

AUDIO - DUwHF #1251 - Brady Smith

In 2019, Dr. Smith created The DRILLED Podcast Network. A non-profit podcast that delivers life-changing dental transformations to some pretty amazing people who need a helping hand. The podcast discusses dental topics in a way for non-dentists to understand and appreciate and gives away $500 of free dental work every weekly episode to a listener.

Dr. Smith is married and has four children ages 1-9. He plays guitar in a very mediocre cover band. He enjoys privately documenting all his experiences with crazy dental patients in a personal diary that he only shares with a select few.

Howard:  it's just a huge honor for me today to be podcast interviewing dr. Brady Smith a dentist who graduated from the university of Pacific in 2009 in the top 7/8 of his class right out of school he purchased a comfort dental franchise in Pueblo Colorado he now owns and operates two successful comfort dental franchises in Vancouver Washington that he started from scratch in 2014 and 2016 both practices grew quickly and now produced one point eight to two million dollars apiece annually in 2019 dr. Smith created the drilled podcast network a non profit podcast that delivers life-changing dental transformations to some pretty amazing people who need a helping hand the podcast discusses dental topics in a way for non dentists to understand and appreciate and gives away $500 a free dental work every weekly episode to a listener Brady is a father of four and a husband of one in his professional life he is a dentist as such he archives of horrific stories that will haunt your dreams you don't even know seriously you don't he was raised in Spokane Washington which is known as one of hundreds of cities claiming to be the meth capital of the u.s. he is an active and practicing member of the Church of Jesus of Latter day Saints Saints thus the reason for specifying he only has one wife he wants to make that clear he Brenda's BYU Idaho where he met his one singular and only wife he plays guitar and a local cover band called the playlist they are not completely terrible man thanks so much for coming on the show how are you doing today

Brady Smith: I mean with a bio and intro like that I I'm I'm on cloud nine this is this is fantastic is so much fun to be with you today 

Howard: oh man I love your energy I love everything you're doing and we both have so many things in common we're both dentists we both are friends and Rick Kirchner and an amazing man but um III wanted to start off with um how does giving away dentistry grow your practice I would think it would your overhead and steal all your time and take all yours supplies how do you how do you give it away to success

Brady Smith: that is a great question I am I'm excited to answer that so let's so I'll use this as an example our very first giveaway that we did for drilled podcast was a woman named Bobby and you can go to youtube and you can watch your transformation we have a little video on our YouTube channel drilled podcast YouTube channel and you can watch your transformation the retail value of the work we did probably is going to be into the twenty-five to thirty thousand dollar range when I met her for the first time she has what we call a guarded smile which is a trained thing people can smile and talk without showing their teeth and you can tell the dentist can tell immediately when someone has a guarded smile so I would look down at the floor or I'd go like this mine laughed that was that became a habit now I'm tearing up but yeah I know it's like back to me again so make assumptions they didn't crack a door or whatever you know what people want to take your home lesser but it really affects your self-confidence a lot I was really scared because I'm just really fearful of the dentist to begin with because of things that have happened to me in my past with Dennis so I was really afraid just the way Brady and his staff just welcomed you I mean no one shames you no one has shamed me at all I love the thing Brady and everyone all the staff all the girls everyone I can't thank you enough it's just because it's just taken and I never would have been able to do this or for this and so I can't thank your nose doing free work for people it seems like it seems like a sacrifice but there's a lot of benefits that come with doing this kind of work it has allowed me to enjoy my job and enjoy what I do and take a lot of pride in the work that we do in the way that we help people out and compels me to use my skills and resources to to help people out you know there's only like two things I feel like I'm really good at one is dentistry and then I also shred on the guitar so those are the two things I share with people is is my dentistry and then I like to play guitar as well I believe that giving this kind of work back to people is is always gonna pay out to me as well I get referrals from people now all I get so many people who hear about what I've done and one of you might and come in and see me and they immediately have trust in me they've never met me before but they immediately have trust because of they've seen what I've done for other people you have the ability to help others out you you ought to do that and then also just the flooding of rewards that come from from doing this kind of work [Music]

Howard:  unbelievable but anyway I watched that I mean man are you already canonized a Catholic saint in Rome from just this case

Brady Smith: my application is in it's under review and and I think they'll be asking you for a recommendation well t

Howard: that's why 69 is my favorite number no why what's our old Mother Teresa was when she got her Nobel Prize and I actually visited her birthplace but anyway but how do you how do you give it away how do you make money giving it away for free

Brady Smith: I mean but this couldn't have been Rick cursors idea leaning me over he'll listen Rick Kushner is he laid the groundwork and one things I really loved about comfort dental when I joined was the amount of charity they do they do every year Lee every Christmas Eve day we do something called care day with a comfort dental reopen our practices up for free dental work for the community which i think is awesome and fantastic and that's actually where I got where I started first seeing you know every care day we ever did every single time and I've been doing it for ten years but without fail 100% guaranteed one of the free patients always converts to a patient for life always every time they come in we do a free dental work and then they come in the next week and there and now they're paying customers and with Bobby once I did Bobby's work you know you do free dental work and it's the best form of word-of-mouth advertising that exists these people go to church and talk about you they talk about you in the grocery store they talk about you your friends and family they do not stop singing your praises and with Bobby I started to get so many referrals that would mention her name and from her daughter her daughter nominated her these giveaways are done via a nomination process so I don't allow people to nominate themselves so her daughter nominated her but between her daughter and Bobby I lost tally at about nine thousand dollars of treatment that I that I've been able to do from referrals that come too - then that I would have never gotten otherwise that's not the reason we do it but it is a by-product that I believe is unavoidable that you start doing this kind of dental work for people even on a smaller scale these people become your patients for life they're coming to you and they have a dental problem if they hear about someone who has a dental problem they're recommending you you are top of their list when talking about where to go for dentistry 

Howard: now is drilled podcast is that one word or two it's two words it's two words okay unless you're on Instagram then I I jump alit all together so it's yeah but it's two words um you you put that podcast up on for free on iTunes on that you ought to upload that on dental town and then and then make up when your YouTube video you should go under humanitarian dentistry and then when you make a post it has that when you go to the YouTube channel you can hit share and there's a layup but the next button over is embed and it's the code and then when you go to dental town to make a post as a YouTube icon you drop the embed in there and I wish I I wish you would do that because um Dentist need to see that I mean that is just a miraculous transformation and yeah and

Brady Smith: I'm slow I'm slow too slow to social networking I actually didn't really do a whole lot of social networking until I created drilled podcast so I'm actually pretty new to getting around and and navigating the crazy world of social networking that we live in and what and what do you what do you make of it

Howard:  I mean I mean do you think oh these I mean sometimes I mean I even had this question in the front of the night I can't tell if this the internet when he came out all information available you thought it would make everyone smarter but it seems to be making a lot of Pete a lot of confused people you know not you know actually worse well what do you what do you think of all this social media in your life

Brady Smith: yeah it's a two-edged sword I mean it's really easy to become involved in an unhealthy way just as far as like time you know time the value of someone's time I think there's some value in social media if you're advertising for your business it's free for the most part and it's a good way to for me or what I want to do is I want I want the ideas of drill podcast to become contagious and I want to advertise the benefits of being charitable and offering service to people using your skills and your talents so social media for me for that reason is great because I get a lot of messages from people and find out who needs help and where they need help and try to broker the relationship between people who need help and people who are willing to help 

Howard: and and so you're giving away $500 and free dental work every single week to a local listener in Portland you got it yeah Wow now did the the news media did their social media pick up on this when you tweet it out do you you know also put on the Twitter links to all the local Portland news stations and stuff like that yeah you know 

Brady Smith: not Twitter links I I called up a few news organizations I've been on a few news programs locally here to advertise what I'm doing and I certainly super helpful to get that kind of exposure yeah so you you um my gosh I would um on every link I mean 

Howard: you you go you're in port you're a suburb of Portland Oregon

Brady Smith:  yeah so Portland Oregon is just right across the Columbia River and just know that's ten minutes away and I'm in Washington State in Vancouver Washington and a little town called just six miles east of Vancouver called Camus but yeah Portland area is as easy to navigate to and from so did you where you are you too young to remember mount st. helens it was a year before I was born oh my gosh erupted 1980 May of 1980 I'm April of 81

Howard:  and my mom's oldest brother chick and live there and gave and sent me a little base of the ashes and oh my gosh that was a crazy about 

Brady Smith: my folks lived in Olympia Washington wouldn't happen and so they got about two inches of ash like snow it was like snow but it was ash instead they got like two inches of ash all over

Howard:  so what year did you graduate um 2009 yeah so let's talk about your journey you graduate 2009 and then you open up your own dental office you scratch practice with comfort no how long did it take before graduation and and you're starting a scratch practice so 

Brady Smith: so my first practice wasn't a scratch practice I actually my first practice was in Pueblo Colorado and it was a comfort dental franchise and it was already a pretty well-oiled machine I would say and I came into an amazing group of doctors who were mentors for me which is one of the main major benefits of comfort dental is just going into a practice where I have mentorship and consulting ability and and you know people to look over my shoulder and looking over other people's shoulder so I got a baptism by fire because of I did more production in one day and I think in three months in dental school and for me it was liberating I always felt kind of hindered in dental school like I never wanted to get that filling and those line angles of those you know your interproximal boxes double-checked and triple-checked so when I came out of dental school and I kind of just I was ready to hit the runway and did very well right from the beginning and then I had an opportunity in 2014 to sell that franchise and open scratch starts in Vancouver Washington and I'm super partial to the Pacific Northwest and love it here and so the opportunity come to Washington was a huge draw 

Howard: so what um it just seems like Rick cursor and I when we got out of school back in the day got out of school I it took me I graduated me 11 I had my own office open from scratch September 21 it seems like today people just want to think about it go from job to job they don't seem happy at it and it takes there's about a five-year gap between graduation day and finally it seems like the only open up their own office cuz they hit rock bottom now you know I'm so sick of working for someone else I'm finally just gonna gonna do it myself

Brady Smith:  isn't that crazy yeah I mean like I feel the the advantage of coming into a confident I'll practice for me I think I shaved that five years off my learning curve for I mean I I just dentistry designed to be you know kind of a solo doc or like multiple doctor practiced and having partners and and being your own boss and and calling the shots and designing your own systems and kind of laying the foundation for your own success and I agree with you I come I come across a lot of associates who don't pull the trigger on very very good opportunities maybe because of fear it's it's a lot of money to buy into things and 

Howard: and they want to sit and wait or whatever reason they have but that was not my mentality and and why do you think that is I mean I've been on um I've been joking for 30 years on the lecture circuit that with you hiring associate and daddy paid for dental school and he's single he's looking at that clock at 5 o'clock he's trying to get out early and he wants to go hit the bars but I said my dad always told me that if you in Kansas said if you see three hungry coyotes walking down a dirt road something's gonna die and I always said man if you get an associate get one that's married stay home wife at least you know two or three kids and that that guy will be there early work through lunch stay late and to joke around here in Phoenix it says make sure your associate is LDS because they're not working for themselves or they're working for a family and are so so where do you think that doesn't want them do you think that's the sole reason why you know I have four kids how many you say you have four four so we each have four kids so we're both equally insane do you think that's we're a lot of the drive and passion comes from because we got little birds and a nests that need a warm drop in their mouth oh you might be on to something with that I I don't know that I have the answer a hundred percent on why why this newer generation is kind of a little slower to pull the trigger on stuff I don't know that I wish I had an answer for that I just know my personal experiences we lay out opportunities that are phenomenal and and and we get people passing and I don't understand it okay so um you know Rick Kirchner is genius in so many ways he was one of the first mentors I latched on to an 87 with his mean and lean he's a he's extremely vocal and opinionated on his his views which a lot of which I think hurts the delivery of his message to some because they just want to hear but he's so right in the fact that associates don't have any skin in the game so why should I do this molar endo when I can just refer to an end adonis why should i try to pull this wisdom tooth and i can just send it to an oral surgeon you you see it at seminars the the owner dentists as they're taking notes and his associate next to him is on snapchat so so does and but the thing I love most about Rick besides that him and his wife Cindy are so adorable what would I like most about him is he's the opposite of the first taste that dentistry put in my mouth when I went to this big old fancy seminar and this guy starts laying out that four types of patients ABCD and half you know and he describes it and when he gets to the seedy enough I realized what that was my whole pedigree and that this guy was saying you don't want people like that and recurse nur it's like you know poor people need a dentist and McDonald's can make money selling a hamburger to a poor person how come too many dentists think they can only have a steakhouse in Beverly Hills so I don't want to put any words in your mouth but to some a quarter of our listeners are still in dental school the rest of them are all under 30 I only get like one email a month from someone who says her as old as me and I and I believe him because they have an AOL email so I know I I assume they also have diabetes they're not Russell Russell was saying leg syndrome but to the newbie they're in dental school they've never heard of Rick curser they'd never heard of comfort dental who's Rick cursed ER and what is comfort of that'll mean to you 

Brady Smith: yeah so you're nailing on the head and I I'll preface that question by saying this when we see these scratch starts so I left a thriving practice in Pueblo Colorado and I came to a practice that had zero patients all I had was a comprehend Tulane in a market where comfort dental didn't wasn't as strong as it was in Colorado where they where they are strongest for sure that's where they started that's headquarters yes exactly right but we drop I had the highest level of confidence in where I just chose to put these practices and I was involved in choosing the locations that I chose the busiest street corners I could possibly find real estate for because I didn't care how many dentists were around me and the reason I don't care how many dentists are around me is because it's so easy for us to beat our competition because most dentists don't market most dentists charge a lot more money than we do and most dentists believe there's an ideal patient and that's a very different mentality there's patients who want and as patients that don't want and so the reason I had that confidence is because of Rick Kushner encumber dental and the idea is I mean nobody understands what patients want better than Rick Kushner he has that dialed in and bases the whole business model around solving patient's problems they care about pain they care about money they care about time and and just we cater to literally everybody I think there's and and and too much in our business you have 80% of the dentists going after 20% of the market leaving a whole swath of America you know underserved and so the idea is yeah we can we can do a crowd for cheaper we can do a filling for cheaper we can pull a tooth for a hundred bucks and we can do very well doing that and serving a population where there is no end and so right for the needs so comfort dental what it means you know what Rick's policies and and not policies but that's not the right word but his his philosophies they allowed they've allowed me to have just tremendous confidence in plop in my business where I get the most traffic not even worried about the ten dentists within 50 miles or within ten mile a ten mile radius or however many there are we're a little oversaturated where we are - but quickly we become super successful all my my both my practices in in Vancouver Washington were making money on month – 

Howard: okay so you you at first so you're saying that location doesn't matter and demographics don't matter because most dentists don't market and yet they're chasing the upper 20% of the patients it seems like many of them are when you when you're charging $1,200 for a crown there's just a

Brady Smith: it's just the just the fact that there's a lot of people who are not they're not gonna plop $1,200 into a tooth I just don't see the value 

Howard: well dentist dentists they only when they make a hundred and eighty five thousand dollars a year they think in chunks are like Oh that'll cost a grand or that watch will be five grand they don't realize that patient that their patients think in dollar units and while they think in thousand-dollar millennium chunks so do you own the real estate under all your locations

Brady Smith: no no at least okay so now do you lease from Rick did he buy the real estate no I know he's done that in some other some other places but in Washington it's a little more far removed and so he isn't as involved in the real estate here but uh no that was up to me I kind of came into this area and was given kind of a little bit of freedom to negotiate leases and execute those contracts and and take care of all the contracting and building of the other practices which was kind of a fun experience to understand that aspect of building a practice and so that was kind of my role in this Washington practice was to create everything

Howard:  I'm just a detour a little bit recursed her the first decade or two that I knew I'm was really comfortable was to businesses it was a dental office you know the comfort dental it was really a real estate business model what McDonough was across didn't McDonald's he would go into a town he'd buy the best location on the corner of 1st Street in Maine and I say that cost five hundred thousand then he'd build his box his restaurant and the real estate and all that be like another st. was another five hundred thousand then he finds this young hungry guy named Brady Smith he's married and has four kids and that a franchise fee would be the exact fee that ray spent developing this McDonald's so to sell the franchise free Brady it costs a million so as soon as you gave Ray Kroc a million his real estate was paid off and then he'd signed you to a 10-year lease to Lisa's deal which was all in court plus a little bit of the business so he charged you a 14 percent of every dollar that came in covered your building lease Marketing headquarters everything and basically every 1st of the month McDonald's has 40,000 franchisees sending them a rent check and and so it's hard to say that McDonald's is into the hamburger business it's in and so my gosh that's another reason why you should own your land and building because the only variable in real estate is when it's it's empty you don't have a tenant so you sell your dental business say for $1 but you sign them to a 10-year lease because you own the land and building now you get another dollar and after 10 years that dentist has paid off his student loans he's pay everything off and now he wants to own the land and building so you sell them that again for $1 so you end up getting $3 while one else retired on one dollar but that's a that's the Ray Kroc business model that rick has done several hundred times I think he has three hundred locations and he's done that to about with about two hundred I'm so so so okay so we talk that so now you open your office and what again go back to this dental kindergartener specifically how are you different what is the comfort dental franchise model yeah so one thing is

Brady Smith: we always open with partners never solo docks so there's always two of us which is extremely helpful it helps us to have longer hours we're open 66 hours a week so we're open Monday through Friday 7:30 to 7:30 we're open Saturday 7:30 to 1:30 a.m. Monday to Monday what are you hours Monday to what money Monday through Friday 7:30 or 7:30 twelve hours every day of the week okay and then Saturday is a half-day so 7:30 a.m. we hope we close at 1:30 and that's pretty standard across all comfort dentals and gosh that one thing okay so money Friday 7:30 7:30 would you say Saturday was 7:30 to 1:00 to 136 hours okay and what go ahead it's a total of 66 hours and that one thing just having extended hours oh my gosh I can't tell you how many evenings and Saturdays I've been working and I get so many opportunities to take patience from other doctors not that I want to but I'm there and the other doctors not so if I have if they have a good experience with me they stick with me because I'm available when they need me so that's cute 

Howard: so you're open 66 hours a week that's why you want partners and and I think what's really neat about recursos he never wanted an associate if you don't have skin in the game he doesn't want you so so the average dental office there's a hundred and sixty eight hours in a week and the average dental office is open is thirty two hours a week which is about 19 percent so 66 / 168 is is 40% so so the average dentist is open 18% of week and you're open 39 percent of the week and is and is is that a big deal 

Brady Smith: yeah my rent is the same regardless of my business hours right there's some stable costs that don't change regardless of how many hours you're open so now I personally only work 30 to 36 hours a week and my partner does the same so I don't work 66 hours a week and neither does my partner we split those we split that share but yeah that's a huge deal - and then of course the idea is there's no ideal patient I want everybody I don't care I mean I it's a big picture that's involved which is very difficult for for a lot of dentists to see I think I do I accept state insurance which is as horrible reimbursement rates but you know so I'll do a extraction that sometimes I get paid $38 to do and I do that because that person who might need an implant someday that person won't have state insurance for their whole life that person knows neighbors and friends and family and cousins and aunts and uncles who need dental working and I want to be a dentist for everybody because I think the volume that's where we flourish is because you got very few dentists going out to those demographics

Howard:  yeah and like like I talked to a person today and they really really wanted to open up San Francisco but they said they have too many hours I mean too many dentists and you know there's no room for another dentist they got to dental schools they got you Appy and they got UCSF as I said yeah let's look at the demographics of San Francisco Monday through Friday 8:00 to 5:00 and now let's look at the demographics of San Francisco from 5:00 p.m. to 6:00 a.m. and Saturday and Sunday and then you'll find out that there are no dentists in San Francisco 

Brady Smith: right that's a great example yeah and I'll tell you this you know comfort dental is a model where not everyone flourishes but most do and that's significant because I think as Dennis you know we're talking about talking to the kindergarten dentist the kids in dental school right now it's important to understand that that you you don't you're going into a market where you're going after if you're going out to the boutique practice it's a lot more difficult but this model that that comfort dental pushes or preaches helps more people become successful more predictably it's that bread-and-butter dentistry it's the lean and mean approach that Rick talks about all the time that approach is an unending line of dentistry going out the door and there's just a lot of dentists just don't want it or they tell themselves they can't serve that people or they have it whatever excuses they have but we are incredibly successful serving that demographic and white whitey 

Howard: why do you think that demographic is I mean you went to school for eight years to help people with your hands to be a surgeon to get them out of pain and you know it's it's all about I mean it's it's like a vocation it's not even an occupation it's it's a vocation to help people alleviate their suffering so how did you go from that to I only want to be lifestyles of the rich and famous in Beverly Hills 

Brady Smith: you know I have a lot of colleagues that are not comfort dental dentists and they've hired gurus and consulting firms that come in and it seems to me the commonality and what these gurus and and and consulting firms tell you is they're telling every day you got to raise your prices and you got to raise your prices and so Dennis keep raising prices they keep on negotiating with insurance companies to raise their prices they just need more and more more and more more and at some point you price yourself out of a huge majority of the US population is it you just your prices are so high that you can't possibly you can't possibly serve everybody and and that's fine there's there needs to be some dentists that operate at the higher echelon level and and do that expensive boutique type of stuff but the is that the summit of a mountain is only so large and can't accommodate everybody there's some there's not everyone can stand on the summit of the mountain at the same time so it just gets a little crowded in my opinion

Howard:  you know it's why I think Aspen is the best of all the DSOs because um bob fontana goes where the dentists aren't and he specifically tracks medicaid he says no no the dentist's one Medicaid and he said he said you go to where the rich people are live in Scottsdale there's a dentist on every corner and you go where all the people aren't Medicaid there's no dental office so he goes there and he has a denture lab guy in fact I've lost several patients to them because if I want to realign your denture you got to leave it with me and pick it up at the end of the day you go to Aspen they got the denture lab guy there and I said hello that's where I'd go I said I don't I don't rely in dentures I don't have a lab tech so since he's so focused on you know go where they ain't my I think they're gonna do well now do you see these DSOs as a threat to you like Aspen is that a threat to you or they kind of following Rick erster enough what why does Aspen on does it is it feeling great I don't

Brady Smith: I don't I'm not well okay so no I'm not threatened by any DSOs at all and one of the reasons are I don't think I think comfort dental might be the only true franchise you might have more information on this but all of our franchises are owner operated there are there's no employee dentists and I think the patients get a feel of a very private practice feel because to me it is private practice confident all gets lumped in with DSO is a lot but the main difference is number one office manager don't call the shots then it's call the shots the owner Dentist call the shots we're not dictated treatment we are not dictated anything clinically we do everything we hire and fire our own staff everything is is super similar to what a solo doc private practice would be like with comfort dental so I think an owner I think the customer service that comes from ownership because I because like you said I have skin in the game employee doc doesn't have skin in the game and that from I understand Aspen you're getting all employee Docs they don't own and operate their own franchises is that correct sure 

Howard: and their number one problem and the end they and me I'm not making this up they they set it on my podcast I've podcasts interviewed probably 10 or 20 of the largest DSO guys in the world it's employee term the associate comes they only  stay a year or two and and out here in Phoenix which has the highest DSO penetration were at eighteen percent and now Arizona just passed the law that we now accept every dental license from all the other 49 states so yeah so and when I got here there was no fluoride in the water and there were no dental schools and now there's two dental schools fluoride in the water and we'll accept your dental license from any state so this is the absolute ground zero and while saying that I can I continue to say that the final DSO model has not to be invented yet because right now the owner wants to own it all because he wants to cash they're on Wall Street and Wall Street wants to own it all and you're this selfish dentist who wants to own it himself and Wall Street how are they gonna make money on how are they gonna make money off Brady if Brady wants to own his own damn dental office they don't want you they want you to be a working man Wall Street wants to own your dental office so how come and so III don't think it's gonna work and since I'm so damn old I already saw the first round of DSOs like orthodontic centers of America they all imploded they're all you know they all bought these amazing successful orthodontists by orthodontist who own their practice and then when he retired now they hired an associate that just came out of school and guess what that young 25 year old kid that just graduated from ortho school didn't have skin in the game didn't have 40 years experience and it was not and it was did not look pretty the whole thing collapsed so is that where do you think this rounded DSOs will do the same because they're trading on a guy like you who's hungry husk in the game and I'm married with four kids and they're gonna try to compete with you with an employee who's looking and see what time the clock is 

Brady Smith: yeah I don't think DSOs can't afford people like me III know it sounds like I'm Tooting my own horn but you know one reason I stayed with comfort dental I'll tell you this my my first paycheck my very first month with comfort dental was $37,000 and I had no idea that was even possible it blew my own expectations out of the water Dennis capability for earning is just too high for what DSOs are paying them and they're only they're only successful to the degree that they can trick dentists into taking lower fees so that they don't because maybe they're afraid of the risk of owning your own practice but I mean we're talking multiples of three and four that dentists can earn what DSOs are paying and it doesn't make any it doesn't I that's what I don't afraid of dsos dsos are literally I think if you hold the dentist's who work there it's a stepping stone they need a year or they need two years to figure out what they really want to do in the meantime Aspen Dental will pay them a paycheck and they'll take it or western dental or in California is a big one there they're all over the place right but they don't provide an environment that makes that dentists want to stay Comfort dental does because I've continued to flourish since my first month and I'm around other dentists who are flourishing and you know my Cee was my partners and I that's three you know III learned just so much just from being around other partners so yeah I'm not afraid of the DSOs I don't think they can afford once once a dentist gets good and they realize start crunching numbers they're out of there they're doing their own thing

Howard:  so I'm you know um you have to be a part in your you're a part you always want a partner um you have a partner you're married um you know a lot of marriages fail um what would you say to someone who says I don't want to be my own boss I don't really want to have a partner I don't want to get married to a dentist I only want to marry someone that's you know sleeps in my bed not not drills in the operatory next to me what would you say to them

Brady Smith: yeah I mean I don't I would never do a non partner I would never be a solo doc it's just it's so much easier to have a partner whom you trust and have like-minded thoughts with to to go about this journey I consult with my partner every single day and it's if I have a hard patient or something you know I have a partner who's only my current partner she's only been in the in the profession for three years even even though you know but she's just so knowledgeable because she does so much dentistry and it's such a value to me to be around and where did you find a partner

Brady Smith: Comfort dental has a recruiting process that I'm not exactly sure where they get I think people hear about it I think word-of-mouth is the biggest way that comfort dental gets people interested and then if you're interested in comfort dental I think they fly you out now back in the day when I joined I had to fly myself but they've wised up and they'll fly you out to Denver for a couple days put you up in a hotel get you a rental car take you out to dinner and they'll tell you all about the organization also I'm available to talk to people - I mean you're interested in a partnership of comfort dental in the state of Washington I I'm a good contact for that but it's a I have a lot of places they recruit from they do some lunch and learns I think it's some dental schools and they recruit from there I think a little bit I'm not exactly sure though

Howard:  you know he um he when he wants to have see me or have me talked to his group whatever he's his private jet down to Scottsdale flies me all the way into Denver everything you talked about and then I say um come on this show and give your pig that'll be the easiest reach any now and I'm like his mental block III don't know what it is I I've had so many comfort dental people on the show but anyway I what I really wish you would do is this has been going on if i if you google comfort dental on dental town there's I mean they're just thread after thread after thread after thread I hope this interview my job is to a little it like this big thread that's up today why does Rick Kirchner not like to incorporate an office and brick doesn't do you know he does Twitter but he doesn't do other stuff but I wish you would start a thread of people like you to explain exactly what they're doing because what you're gonna end up doing is taking their brain out for a 5 a 10 mile run I mean it's undeniable that after 300 how many how many comforts are there now is it 300 yeah I lost count I think we're in like 12 or 13 or 14 states yeah so so you can't say this doesn't work when there's 300 of them in 14 states I mean but I don't think my homies I love them to death I love their passion I love everything about him but when you're dealing with them from the business of Dentistry it can be challenging because they get 

Brady Smith: so I got into podcasting and when I started listening to dental podcast you know most dental podcasts I would say that the vast majority of dental podcasts are how to double your production three easy ways to make your clinical life easier they're very much how to build a successful practice and it's a bit a lot a similar idea so when I started drill podcast I wanted it to be different I wanted to be you know giving away dentistry as a way to create which is an idea I stole from Rick Kushner I'm doing a little differently by doing these huge full mouth rehabilitation giveaways taking one person changing their life dramatically and trying to recruit other dentists to do the same with me so when we create a drill podcast we we wanted to be a little separate from them so we still have the dental talks and we have themes and dental conversations but it's geared a little bit more towards how the patient would understand it and you know I started drilled podcast or I started giving away dental work far before I started drilled podcast because I didn't like my job which is really difficult for a dentist to turn around do a 180 when they realize they're not happy with what they do so about five or six years ago I just didn't like what I was doing and I did three things that change the way I practice one is I stopped doing dentures because I don't I just don't like them one is I started to fire staff that I didn't want around instead of giving them second and third chances that made a big difference and the third thing was giving away dentistry to people that I discerned were needing it and legitimately couldn't afford it and it would change their life so I did that and it just turned everything around for me and so bringing it back to that kind of a conversation here drilled podcast is designed to build everybody up everyone mean just the idea that giving away things is is a way to build your practice is a very unique idea and one that requires a little bit of risk to try it out but I believe in it wholeheartedly that isn't it 

Howard: yeah I am stop doing dentures on that as I'm you know you're either in Phoenix Arizona where they got denture world and denture universe and there was some 80 year old ladies saying you know I could go down denture world get it done for $100 I'm like ma'am I'll Drive you there myself I mean I i'd rather be a pole dancer Chippendales for to earn a hundred dollars than realigning a denture fire staff they don't like I mean I can't tell you in 30 years how many times I been at a dental office and I one time the the hygienist pulled up and he said oh my god let's go to the break room cuz she's gonna come right through that door and I thought you're you're hiding in the break room because someone you give money to come here I'm any sight you can't I mean does you just can't work with people that you don't like or have chemistry with I mean it's not right or wrong it just doesn't work exactly yeah 

Brady Smith: you're right and though those two things made a huge difference but also you know the the first person that I extended an invitation was a young lady at a Wendy's drive-through I'm kind of confessing here I go to Wendy's way more often than I should because I recognize I was on a first-name basis with this individual that was always working the drive-through she had very visible decay on her front teeth I saw her two or three times a week probably and one day I gave him my card I said hey if you come into my practice I will fix your teeth you will not pay a dollar I will help you out it took her about two weeks and eventually I saw her and she came in and she was the first person where I really experienced a change in my approach to dentistry where I I was so excited to come to work I was so excited going home thinking about these cases and getting excited about looking around my own little world for the next person that I want to do this for and ever since then about every couple of months I find somebody out in the world or coming through my office and I give them the whole spiel where you come to me we're gonna take care of your problems for free and most people take me up on it a few do not surprisingly but I mean it's it's just finding the things that change your world mean everything and finding the things for some people it might not be made some people love dentures some people hate root canals so don't do root I mean just figure out what you can do to change your environment but those were the main things that change my environment was giving people the industry they need getting rid of employees that that when I say giving them second and third chances it's really the it's really me being afraid to have the conversation of I'm gonna let you go you're just not a good fit here and then getting rid of dentures denture here's the thing interestingly enough I don't remember repeat patients a lot about Haitians names I remember almost all of my difficult dentures patients names to this day they haunted me and I getting rid of them when I saw them on my on my schedule for days I would dread seeing them and yeah just just I didn't find those things and getting rid of those things in your life makes a huge difference 

Howard: um do you know why Wendy's has only uses square patties no I don't know why that's because they don't cut any corners I thought I thought that guy was they you know my dad was in a sonic drive-in so you know that was that was one of his leaders and i thought dave was a cool guy but he was the same type of guy he was trying to bring high-quality food to the mass market that's what Henry Ford did Henry Ford said I mean there was like 86 car companies before Henry 4 but it's a bunch of guy he's making one car for a king or a queen and he said we're gonna make this for the masses I'm another how can my homies help you get out you're drilled podcast message

Brady Smith: thank you yes okay so when we do these big giveaways you know I started with Bobby I mentioned Bobby a lot she was our first I got 15 just like 15 like really good nominations that I was thumbing through so for every one person that I accepted I had to deny 14 this last round we are in the process right now we just gave away three more giveaways because we had I have two more dentists that have agreed to help out and I've paired them with an individual who's in need so instead of choosing one nomination I was able to choose three and we'll do this again in November every six months I might be doing another full mouth giveaway via this nomination process so I need people I I get messages all the time on Instagram and Twitter hey I'm in North Carolina I need is there any way I can participate as a patient or I'm in New Jersey how can I get so what I need is I need dentists who are saying you know Dentist who are open to this message open to the idea of giving up their time and services capable and competent of giving services and treating people like they were their mother and what drill podcast does is we broker that relationship I have implant companies and a few dental supply companies that have donated free supplies for all of my cases so we're negotiating those relationships to get free materials donated implant direct is donating all implant supplies that are needed so big shout out to them who's who pulled that strain implants direct was it um was it Gerald rip no but firm implants torque was that Jerry Resnick did he know it's it's it's more about Gia what's the were like a local more local level because the case is now I want drill to become a national thing if drill becomes a national thing I need a staff I don't have money to pay a staff i I'm a one-man operation right now so I am looking for donations and possible opportunities to finance a bigger operation that can do a more of a national national thing and get this word out and do you know ideally I would be turning away dentists not turning away patients that I'd have so many dentists being and wanting to be involved you know I got a dentist in New Jersey I got a Denison in Atlanta I got a dentist in in Texas I got a dentist in LA and having dentists kind of scattering the the United States who have said if you can find someone I will take care of them and and and then getting them set up to to take care of this one individuals needs and just changing wives one at a time but ideally next go-around I have another three dentists who have volunteered already for November couple in the Seattle area a little bit more local to me but we are slowly gonna try to branch out and then eventually to get this national we'll need a we'll need a operating staff to do that but but we have the ability and we're making the right relationships and and get making the right connections to start something that I think is gonna be really special 

Howard: well I'll tell you what let's this podcast is the star we're posting on dental town it's a star you want to write up an article for the magazine it's funny how all the young kids think all the dentists are only on Instagram but the magazines are still the most it's the biggest response that's why there's all those advertisers in there and what I also like about it is you know I got so many people like you that want to always come on during Halloween and talk about their Halloween candy buy back program I'm like have you ever talked to a military dentist they're all bunch of kids from 17 to 25 with massive decayed horrible eating habits not really brushing and flossing and you're a dentist with eight years of college and your best idea is to send them a bunch of candy what was your next best idea I'm just curious Oh what was your second best I did a send the troops no opiates I mean like you know it's like it's like look at all the disasters going on economically from the Indian reservations in Arizona and what was their best idea oh let's give them the only license for a casino yeah that's what they need they need gambling you know what should be next the only place you know hand in hand with alcohol to gambling and alcohol are our peanut butter and jelly yeah and so so I am I at the Halloween candy buy back but it's for our troop so it's very romantic and patriotic and you know you don't want to say anything so that's why I have to call it dentistry uncensored so on so yeah so I'm if you want to you know let's do everything to try to get this program out I think it's Sony

Brady Smith: email me the easiest way if you do want to be involved email me dr. Brady Smith it drilled podcast at all I need is an area and sand and sand again dr. what's email yeah the email is drilled podcast and tell me where you live tell me what you're willing to do and I will absolutely hook you up and on my own podcast episodes once I have a doctor in an area I advertise that and say if you live in the New Jersey area I have a doctor in the New Jersey area we're gonna extend this giveaway tuner to Newark New Jersey because we can so we haven't done anything further than Seattle at this point if I don't have anybody who has volunteered to to do that dental work for me there you can also follow us on drill podcast on Instagram Twitter Facebook and YouTube soon to be LinkedIn we'll get a LinkedIn account now if your old podcast just Pio DC ast there's no just there's no s at the end correct okay and it's two words two words okay this is you can subscribe you can subscribe to subscribe to the podcast on iTunes or Google Play or whatever pot wherever you get podcast it should be available and support the podcast that way and

Howard:  yeah and upload it on dental town this whole podcast is because of Trump and Hillary it was uh it was one year before the election I can't believe we're a year away from the next election and all these dentists start calling me up and saying dude I get our commute to work and I can't listen this toxic crap for an hour each way I hate it I hate it I'm listening to podcasts on elk hunting and cooking and raising kids and so now the dental town app which has downloaded by sixty sixty-nine thousand dentists there's probably 30 or 40 dentists uploading their dental podcast they all say it makes their iTunes explodes because they the the dentist found it first on the dental town app and then they went back and subscribe to it on YouTube or iTunes or whatever so uh I I put that up there and then for you kids out there your elders they didn't like to network with the value chain you know Delta gives them $100,000 a year and they write up nasty letters they 88 didn't sell any dental insurance they give them a thousand dollars of money and you got a network with your value chain and the whole dental value chain is on LinkedIn and I am humbled by the 40,000 dental people working in dentistry that aren't drilling and filling but making all the stuff that makes us look great falling as a LinkedIn but if you want to get the dental value chain from manufacturers insurance suppliers you want to get all the people other than the people working in the delivery dentistry it's on LinkedIn and it's it's amazing guy we are you rushed for time do you got to get it you got to go pretty quick I want to switch back to the comfort model trim plan one of the things that Rick is so outspoken about is dentists do new patient cleanings you know you call up I want to get my teeth Lele scheduling with the hygienist does not want an associate and that's not is he still is it still the six step process on a new patient 

Brady Smith: pretty similar yeah I don't think a lot has changed since the 80s or 90s a few things yeah one things that one thing that blows people's mind is that we don't hire hygienists not that we're not allowed to we certainly can and there's some confident that definitely have a hygienist but you know we operate under a lean and mean philosophy and hygienists are expensive and dentists can do the cleanings and so I do a lot of my own scalings a lot of my dental assistants are qualified and legally allowed to do you know super gingival polishing coronal polishing is a dental assistant responsibility so we use extended function dental assistants a lot who place fillings for us so I got they pack cord take crown impressions build temporaries so we just use what we can use that makes more financial sense but yeah the idea that's definitely turned off a few newbies who come to my who come my way they have just been taught that I think all the money is in hygiene and so without a hygiene department somehow I'm not making that money from hygiene and that I mean they're kind of blinded by what they've been taught they're new and they I've just been taught by maybe someone any other gurus that you know you make X percent of your paycheck is from hygiene so for comfort dental is and have a hygiene department that just disappears when in fact it's there plus more because I don't pay a high dentist and go do the cleaning so I make all that money from I do have a hygiene department it's just it's me and what is your overhead between 44 and 52% okay

Howard:  okay and so here's a reality checked because I know humans believe what they want to believe but here's the evidence there's only three publicly dental traded stocks today and none of them are on America tour in Australia and ones in Singapore and none of them have hygienists for the reasons you said because they have to make profit and it's episode 850 with CEO of one three hundred smiles episode eight 41 is Pacific smiles group 373 is a QM and they said the same thing they how can I pay a hygienist forty dollars an hour to do a cleaning for 60 bucks I mean they just look at you like did you take math and then here's comfort dental same thing so three out of three publicly traded where they have to show their statement income their balance sheet their P&L; don't have hygienists and you don't have hygienists and and then there's dentists that are on Facebook all day I'm complaining about how tough dentistry is while they're sitting there and the reason are sitting there is because they're paying someone forty dollars to do a sixty dollar cleaning and you just don't buy into it well so I've had this conversation with colleagues of mine here's an interesting debate that I've had you'll find this interesting Howard we were debating how long it takes to do a quadrant of scaling and root planing now I was talking to a dentist who's been a dentist for ten years like me we went to dental school together we're good friends so we can banter back and forth and I said it takes about 15 minutes to do a quadrant maybe less 10 minutes to do one quadrant of stealing and root planing and he said no it takes an hour and I said how many quadrants is scaling a root planing have you done since dental school and he said zero and I said I've done tens of thousands of quadrants of scaling and root planing since dental school if the patient is numb I don't have to worry about that I can finish a quad in less than ten minutes no problem but I get paid by the job and a hygienic Spade in most cases by the hour so they're gonna fill that hour and and it's it's funny how hygienists always take the full hour they they rarely finish early because by doing so they cheapen their own value and they don't want to do that obviously so it's this interesting idea of like a lot of dentists are a little bit confused about how long cleanings should take because they don't actually do it themselves that's dictated to them by the hygienist who works for them who gets paid by the hour and has to justify their own existence and again it's not like hygienists are useless

Brady Smith: I don't I definitely don't feel that way they're super useful but the idea that a deep cleaning for quadrants is going to take two hours of chair time is insane to me and that is the dentist's are being deceived that just it just doesn't take that long to do to do that and I I encourage my buddy who came to me afterwards I said go spend five minutes cleaning one tooth and see how that feels time it for five minutes put the timer on for five minutes because that's what you're saying or like I think it was three minutes was what we decided clean a tooth for three minutes one single - don't leave that tooth just clean it constantly for three minutes and tell me if that feels like an eternity and he texted me the other day and said a couple days afterwards says you're right that feels like an eternity and I had that too cleaned in one minute instead of three and it was eye-opening for him to to go to a couple Kwas himself and feel like how long it actually takes to do job 

Howard: so um Rick Kerster is the most notorious thing in my mind is his chart of four dentists who make $25,000 paychecks each month the one with 40% you said your overhead was what 1% to what it's right around 50 it's a little below some I'd say 44 to 50 to rain 44 to 52 so let's so let's so what does that actually mean so here's four dentists that make $25,000 a month in a paycheck at 40% overhead you had to do only do 41 thousand dollars of Dentistry at 50 percent overhead obviously I'd do 50 thousand 825 but it's 65 percent overhead which is the national average you have to do 71 thousand dollars with the dentistry and that alone is the whole hygiene Department to Hawaii Janice and since about 20 percent of practices are at 80 percent overhead they have to do a hundred and twenty-five thousand dollars of Dentistry to net twenty five thousand dollars so what would it what is the secret I mean what percent of the dentists listening to you right now have fifty percent overhead well I have you know copper dentals very transparent I have access to all the numbers of all the offices they report their numbers on the Excel spreadsheet that through our business emails and I have access to that most comfort dental is operated around 50 percent with very few exceptions I don't you know I always hear these numbers what did you say the average overhead was what was it the ADF so for a statistically significant sample and how you pick your sample size and done by phd's the the national average Brady Smith: is 65 percent okay and I've heard that he's not uncommon to find it practices with 65 percent 75 percent even some cases higher overhead but that's killer overhead to me is the number one most important statistic it I don't care what your collection numbers are I don't care what your production numbers are if I'm evaluating a practice I want to be a part of if I'm selling a practice to someone and I want them to be a part of it the overhead numbers are what I'm selling it's that you don't have to work as hard to make as much with me you got to work harder to make the same amount of money somewhere else if their overhead seventy five percent sixty five whatever sixty five percent is but that extra 10% 50% it is a killer to watch that money leave your practice and not go in your pocket and it's such a blessing when you figure out a formula that works well that allows you to pocket more the money but we're wondering what would is the the driver why do you think comfort dental averages 50 percent overhead in over 300 locations 

Brady Smith: and the average dentist is 65 where's that extra 15 percent coming from extended hours multiple partners a lot of people will think I talked a lot of people that they say oh well you guys get like tremendous discounts on supplies all right we are a larger company and we do get a little bit of a discount on supplies from Henry Schein Henry Schein exclusively I believe I don't think we use Patterson or any other company but we do get a little bit of a discount it's not a lot but extended hours is huge multiple Docs is huge and then you know lower fee dentistry keeps our chairs full all the time all the time there's never any shortage of dentistry to do which make puts me in a position when I'm discussing crowns and root canals and implants and all bridges or fillings or with patients we have a very nice cordial and civil discussion and if they're not gonna pull the trigger I thank them kindly and and move on because I got three people in the chair waiting for me who are going to poultry 

Howard: um so do you think the best marketing I mean if you ask an economist well how do you how do you sell anything they say well if you raise the price it will have no lasting effect on demand and I give when you sell them our city's been drilling in so one lower the price the price has an elastic effect on demand and you'll sell more cars that's why Ford sells a million for escorts and only a few you know Cadillacs so do you think low fee dentistry is the best marketing 

Brady Smith: I mean if you believe that there's an ideal patient then you're probably not going to buy into that idea if you think there's a patient I want and there's a patient I don't want but I'm perfectly capable of doing boutique dentistry I can do veneers I can do cosmetic work on people and I can do $100 extraction for someone who doesn't want to pay the money for a root canal and I can treat both those patients with respect I can make them both happy I can make them both feel comfortable my office without judgment so yeah you just gotta have the mentality that I want everybody to be my patient I don't that's the mentality I can't teach someone if what I do or how to do what I do if they believe there's a certain type of person I don't want my office because of their insurance so because of their socio-economic position that's a that you got to shred yourself with that idea and and I think you can be successful and then yeah and then yes lower fee dentistry I mean and 

Howard: and just go through the logistics then if it's all based on a six-hour shift like your Saturday shift seven thirty one thirty so you basically have two shifts a shift does 7:30 to 1:30 and then a different dentists and shift does the 1:30 or 7:30 or are they two different total sets of people does is the a.m. team leave and the PM team shows up with the staff

Brady Smith: the staff doesn't change typically well sometimes they do are so the dentist changes yeah the dentist changes some of the staff choose to do 12-hour shifts some staff some of our worker bees love it because they do 12 hours they get their hours in three days and then they have a four-day they have a four-day weekend and they really like that so yeah we have to have staff that covers everything but for the most part my particular practice all of my all of my staff does 12-hour shifts so they we don't they don't change at 1:30 but the doctor does and we're at a time I mean we are we went way over but and is it still the six step process and can you name those steps they comfort metal flow I you know I don't know I don't know what six steps you're referring well you used to always talk about you know the typical dental office you know they call up they say I want my teeth clean they schedule an hour with the hygienist and it's a very and the dentist goes in for you know five minutes and tries to do a new patient exam or no I want to meet you first out of the operatory and meet the dentist first so you do that you meet from the phone call patient is offered a new patient has offered a same day or next day visit like that is gospel you do that you get them in you don't give them the opportunity to go somewhere else you get them in right and they want to get in especially if it's an emergency if they're hurting or not feeling well once they get there the first thing they fill out some paperwork they they come into a little room and I meet them for a three-minute conversation about what they're doing there find out the chief concern talking about what their goals are what they want to do why they're there how I can help them so I ascertained the primary reason they're there I try to do my best to listen an opportunity do that in private office in a private consultation room small when the Howard: patient shows up the first thing they're gonna do is be taken in that consultation room and meet the doctor exactly and that is that is a you just saw an earthquake I mean forget about this hurricane in Florida I mean you this should have just knocked you out of your chair you cannot not do that so the so the patient meets you in the new patient compensation room 

Brady Smith: yeah and patients get weirded out in a good way because they're like I have never had a doctor come talk to me from the beginning but it's but but you know some people need a PA because they're in pain and it's acute pain we're gonna take one PA some people need a full now series of x-rays so the next step after that is for me to determine what's needed I put them in an opera Tori with an assistant who greets them introduces themselves takes the full male series of x-rays I disappear for that ten minutes I come back in we do a full exam with the x-rays and we determine the needs create a plan usually not doing a cleaning in the same day but if it's important patient I try to listen to that and and try to get that try to accommodate what they want and then we get a plan talk about finances doctor talked about finances not I don't delegate that to anybody I talk about finances myself and 

Howard: oh my god it's just uh I mean it's amazing yeah you don't do new patient cleanings on so what would you tell someone who has high overhead what would you tell them to do

Brady Smith: get a lower overhead it's you know it depends on what systems they're using what they're trying to do well I'll tell you what one of my practices here that I don't practice in anymore I had a little bit of a higher overhead and we had to go in there and make a determination that we had to cut back some staff and and go back to some basics and start with a little bit of a lighter schedule and kind of sometimes you got a you got a start from scratch a little bit and for lack of a better phrase I suppose and just figure out what's costing you I mean you got a hopefully people do inventory of their own practice they know what their I mean I did it should know what are you paying for supplies how much is your overhead every two weeks or your your payroll these are numbers that if a dentist doesn't know them on the top of their head you know who else is gonna know that information

Howard:  I know my as my boys are so well that you know they're all you know there's all now they're all old they're all 24 to 30 but gosh I would call you know we go to restaurant I'd call the the manager over and tell them that my dad had a restaurant I'm a dentist and and all that stuff but then I just ask him like like what are your numbers and when they didn't know their numbers I tell my boys came there in the restaurant business it's a twenty to forty percent failure rate and this guy won't even be open and in 32 years my dental office has been open only three restaurants or there when I started and still there and they all know all the numbers final question you say the threat to our profession from is from the government or any programs that paid dentist by counter 

Brady Smith: oh this is a whole other podcast Howard this is my soapbox this is a the only place that I will actively throw under the bus in a dental clinic are the government-run clinics in the state of Washington and Oregon they're called federally qualified health centers and they do medical services as well which I don't know a whole lot about but their dental services are paid by encounter meaning and I know what the numbers are did I did a lot of research on this and got talking to the CFO of the Medicaid program in the state of Washington who revealed all these numbers to me state of Washington if you go through a federally qualified health center there's I don't know thirty five of them in the state of Washington in different areas they get paid two hundred and twenty-five dollars every time they see an individual regardless of what they do to that individual so Howard if you have my twenty two hundred twenty-five dollars okay that was in two thousand sixteen when I was doing this research and I was heavily for every time a patient sees a dental office and a federally qualified health services in the state of Washington every time a patient goes in there that the place just gets $225 yes so if they take a full set of x-rays one x-ray if they do an exam if they do a cleaning it doesn't matter there's not itemized they get paid $225 for that encounter once the encounter is over they schedule another visit and that next encounter is also going to get paid out $225 so if you need 12 cavities Howard and you go to a federally qualified health center how many visits do you think it's gonna take you to get 12 cavities done at least 12 the answer is 12 so so this play these places have the worst reviews online but have the longest wait times these three months to get in because their wait times are insane and how is that possible if there's such a terrible nobody likes them but they feel corralled and I believe that government entities are trying to funnel I don't want to sound too much like a crazy kooky conspiracy theorist but the reimbursement rates are so low that they must know private practice dentists are not going to accept those those rates I am a exception to that rule I refuse to not accept state insurance I feel compelled to offer my services to everybody so I limit the amount of state that I see I don't with these lower insurance reimbursement rates I cannot open the floodgates cannot do that I have to see on a limited basis so I have like two columns of state patients a day that I see but these encounter programs will make on 1212 fillings they're gonna clean up they're gonna make 2,700 bucks on 12 fillings twelve fillings I get that done in two visits and I get paid 400 bucks 500 bucks to get that done but I do it in two visits so it's a it's a it's it's incentivizing neglect and that is why on a government level and there's dentists that are doing this knowingly and they know the program and what it's all about and and and that is it's wrong to me and I think it needs to be shot up in the rooftops Oh what are you right 

Howard: why don't you write that up for dental town or or how would how would we go about this um who's the owner you know

Brady Smith: I'd be happy to have any kind of any kind of platform to talk about this listen it's the government who makes these clinics who pays themselves exorbitant fees that they reap they reap the benefits from so it's the government paying the government to get fat and rich and some of these managers who have got to like know someone who's a cousin to the governor of state of Washington these these federally qualified health centers their managers and people who operate this are making six to eight hundred thousand dollars a year as government employees it is a racket that is going under the radar that is it's just obscene to the dental profession to allow these kind of programs to exist that incentivize elect that's what they do they incentivize neglect 

Howard: well we have to do this because the new generation they think that free enterprise is basically evil and who's gonna save them is the federal government and you know yeah you know and it just comes down to a simple decision making if you're you know when I was growing up you know Moscow made all the farming decisions for their farmers and they had you know a two trillion dollar economy and they had to import wheat and in America said well you're the damn farmer you make the decision and and so we had a six trillion dollar economy and we are weed exporter it's the same thing we're talking about where when you're a dentist associate and the CEO is calling the business model another city another country another state you have the DSO model and when you have owner-operators you have the comfort dental model and there's no one in economics who doesn't want the person standing in the environment where all the data is to not make the decision and big government big Association big people with no real world experience think oh no it's like when your state has to call the Department of Education to figure out what book to have six year olds read in the first grade really if there's no one in your state that can pick a book for a first grader to read well maybe maybe you guys should all just move to another state I mean ah you know you're preaching to the choir here our it's just it's just you there's no there's no evidence of a model that works this government type of models are

Brady Smith: just they're just terrible and they're just so inefficient and nobody wants to make decisions because no one wants to take risks nobody wants to be responsible or held accountable for these types of programs and so you can't hold anyone accountable the state of Washington cannot audit federally qualified health centers they don't know how much dentistry is being done for the one hundred and seventy-five million dollars the state spends every year on this dentistry because all they can report is how many encounters they've got you don't know how much dentistry is being done you can't report that it's unreported and

Howard:  it's genius I mean what they did is they made it so there's no transparency so they don't have to be accountable yeah that's um that's amazing uh will you write that up and I will put it put it out I will publish it I appreciate that I'll get you a write-up I'll get you right up for sure I appreciate the platform okay and last but not least what can my homies do to him to help get out the drill podcast just send you an email to

Brady Smith: subscribe to the podcast support it that way and then email me at drill podcast at and let me know the level of involvement that you'd like to have all right 

Howard: well Brady thank you for everything you're doing for dentistry I'm a big fan of you thank you so much it was an honor to podcast you today right back at you I can't thank you enough for the platform you're providing man and and hopefully this is contagious and and it gets more people fired up to do some good out there alright buddy have a great day you too 

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