Kiera is joined by Derick Van Ness of Big Life Financial to talk about taxes, and how to handle them beyond simply thinking of them as a necessary evil. The pair discuss knowing your numbers, utilizing tax credits, the magic touch of a CPA, and more.
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Transcript:
The Dental A Team (00:00)
Hello, Dental A Team Listeners, this is Kiera. And today I am super excited. This is one of our top favorite guests that has been on the podcast. We're bringing him back on because there are some new updates and our clients love him. I love him. He is incredible. Derick Van Ness, he is with Big Life Financial. And you might have heard him on the podcast before talking about R &D credits, tax saving ideas, CPA.
This man does a lot of your wealth and how to build and keep your wealth. So I always love our conversations and just like his good information. Plus, if I remember right, he might know Garrett Gunderson. So obviously I've been a fangirl since day one. Derick, welcome back to the show. How are you today?
Derick Van Ness (00:42)
Well, I'm doing great and really happy to be here with you, Kiera. I'm not Garrett Gunderson because he is taller and better looking, but I'm a good second place.
The Dental A Team (00:48)
Ha ha ha!
I think that you're great. The fact that you know Garrett Gunderson, that already just has elevated you. I mean, I think it was one of our first conversations we ever had. And I was like, have you ever read like Killing Sacred Cows? And you're like, I actually know Garrett Gunderson. I was like, what? Fangirling. So ? anyway, Derick, for those who have not met you, haven't heard your episode, because we do have new listeners to the podcast. Just kind of give them a little intro of who is Derick Bennis? What is Big Life Financial? And give the listeners a little intro to who you are.
Derick Van Ness (01:20)
Okay, well outside of being ? in love with my wife, in love with art and in love with racing sailboats, what I do professionally is I help ? doctors and dentists to be smarter with their money. So what does that mean? That means how do you, not so much to make it, I mean we do help people scale, but once you make the money, which is something a lot of dentists are good at, how do you keep it through tax savings? How do you grow it and how do you protect it, right?
And today we're going to talk a little bit about how do you keep more what you make? Because honestly, for dentists, even though taxes seem boring when you don't have to write that $50,000 or $100,000 or $200,000 check, it gets a lot cooler. If you would have told me I'd be a tax and financial guy when I was a kid, I probably would have just taken an early exit somewhere and jumped off a bridge. But I really see money in what we do as a lifestyle business. It's not about money.
The Dental A Team (02:01)
Yeah.
Derick Van Ness (02:17)
If you have enough, then money is what it is. When you don't have enough, it's a problem. And I just find for a lot of people, it's the reason or excuse that they constrain themselves. They don't spend time with family. They don't think do things that they want to do. They don't have the experiences that are going to change their life. So when we can get money out of the way, then you can live your big life, which is why the company's big life financial, because it doesn't matter if you have more or less money. The question is, what's the life you're living? What's your quality of life?
And so taxes are a big piece of that. Obviously we can't talk about everything on a podcast like this, because you'd be buried under a ton of bricks. But that's what I do is I try to make this stuff easy. I try to make it fun. And I want you to realize that the whole point of all this money stuff is so that you can live a life you want to
The Dental A Team (02:55)
You
Which Derick, that's why we have connected. You have met my husband. have had personal conversations outside of the podcast because I very much align and subscribe to this lifestyle and this mode of thinking. I believe that practices should work for us and us not work for our practices. I believe that we became business owners to have these big lives and these, audacious dreams. And yet I feel so many people live below their, their potential. They are trapped. They are.
Derick Van Ness (03:33)
Mm-hmm.
The Dental A Team (03:34)
It's crazy. I ? had a client and she actually made so much money last year, which was amazing because the year before she was like, Kiera, I want to make more. So I was like, great, we're going after profit and production like blinders on. Don't talk to me about anything else. And she had like a crazy year and she's like, great. Now I have this huge check. I've got to write in taxes. And I was like, not my problem. Like you need better CPA help on that, but glad we made you the money. But I bring that up because one, it was a huge win for a client, but two,
Derick Van Ness (03:52)
I don't know.
Yep.
The Dental A Team (04:02)
I think that people being able to keep the money that they make, hold on to more money that they make. Like I love that we live in America and it's a free country and that we get to pay taxes. Like I'm so freaking grateful for that. With that said, I do not want to pay one penny more than I need to. And I want to maintain and keep as much as I possibly can to live the life I want and to not feel the guilt of being a successful business owner and to do the fun things that I always imagined and dreamed of doing without the guilt of doing it. And I think so many people are so scared of.
Derick Van Ness (04:11)
Yep.
The Dental A Team (04:32)
being financially free, they're scared to spend money. They get hit with tax burdens left and right. I can't tell you how many dentists that I hear at the end of their career and they've had great careers, but they have no financial stability. like, Derick, this is the stuff that stresses me out and keeps me up at night and which is why you're on the podcast because I want people to be smarter. want them to be more educated and I want them to live happier lives. So let's walk through like R and D credits and CPA and like how people can live a more enriched
Derick Van Ness (04:33)
Mm-hmm.
Yep.
The Dental A Team (05:02)
big life today rather than waiting. I think it's just a fun topic to talk about. I'm intrigued, so let's talk about it.
Derick Van Ness (05:07)
Yeah
Well, let's do. mean, we can start generally with taxes and then we can kind of move into the credits piece because it is like a it's just a small very segmented piece of what you do with your taxes. overall, the biggest thing I see is most people see taxes as like a necessary evil. This is the thing I have to deal with. When people see something as a necessary evil, what do they do? They do the minimum. Right. And what that really turns into is
You're not talking with your CPA. You're not coordinating with them. You're not being proactive. At the end of the year, you just want to do the least. So you just hand them all your stuff. I realize people don't come in boxes anymore. Now it's like, here's my QuickBooks password. Or I add you to my account. ? And then they tell you how much you owe. But if you ran your business that way, if you just didn't look at anything all year, and at the end of the year, you're like, I wonder how we did. Wouldn't go so well if you didn't talk to your team about anything. What's that?
The Dental A Team (06:01)
People do that though, Derick. They do it all the
time. This is not abnormal. They do it all the time. They're like, my gosh, I owe how much? my gosh, we didn't hit goal. And I'm like, ? let's at least look at our numbers. Like that's step one. Step two, let's talk to our team. You're not wrong. I'm just shocked at how many people do this in real life. And I'm like, hey, there's a different way of living. like, maybe let's take that path. Just try it out. It's like t-shirt. Try that one on. It might feel better than your current oversized, like two baggy of clothes that don't fit. And then you're angry.
Derick Van Ness (06:11)
I know.
The Dental A Team (06:30)
the time. anyway go on didn't mean to interrupt the rant.
Derick Van Ness (06:32)
What if I'm gonna be
a Gen Z VSCO girl? I I want the Oversight T-shirt and the angst.
The Dental A Team (06:36)
Well, as I said it, as I
said it, I was like, well, that's like the current style. Like what's uncomfortable clothing? Maybe it's like the wool scratchy. I just came back from Iceland and I'll tell you what, I didn't buy a single shirt there. I was like, that is gonna scratch me. I know it's warm, but I'm not wearing that for the rest of time. Like there are softer clothes in this world that are equally as warm. Like I'll choose that. So that maybe you're wearing a wool scratchy sweater. Cause you never look at your numbers. You're always irritable. You're always angry.
Maybe you might get the oversized hoodie that's way more comfy. Maybe that's the better analogy for today.
Derick Van Ness (07:07)
Well, and so you help them look at their numbers, right? What's your P &L? What are your KPIs? There are tax numbers too, right? Like I'm usually meeting with clients in September-ish to say, OK, how much have you made so far this year? What does that put us on track for December 31st? And then we have November, I'm sorry, September, October, November, December to do things to get that number at the end where you want it to be. I'm not talking about go out and spend $1.
to save $0.40, right? People do that. Oh, go buy a car. If you don't need a car, that's just a waste of money. I literally had someone who's like, should I just buy a G-Wagon? I'm like, only if you were going to buy a G-Wagon anyway. They want the tax break, but.
The Dental A Team (07:45)
I mean, I asked that question too.
I mean, I do. I do ask it as well, but it's unnecessary. You're right. Like, so I can repel you you're not going to do it. Don't just because you get the tax benefit. You just have to pay the money. So, but I do ask because I want to know, just tell me I can buy the boat, Derick.
Derick Van Ness (07:58)
Yeah.
Well, boats are totally different. They're way more fun, but they're also way more expensive to maintain. So I love boats. I absolutely do. But they are not cheap, right? As the saying goes, break out another 1,000. That's what boat stands for. Just go to the ocean and throw $1,000 in it every month. That's what owning a boat's like if you don't use it.
The Dental A Team (08:05)
They are not. I know.
gosh, I've never heard that.
That's hilarious.
That's hilarious. I've heard like the best day and worst day of owning a boat is the day you buy it and the day you sell it. Like that's the only best days. I have a boat. I do love the boat. It is an older boat. things I'm not... Maybe mine's like break out a 10 because we've got a much older boat. But like, know, when we upgrade then we'll be in the thousand realm. ?
Derick Van Ness (08:28)
So.
Yep.
Yeah.
Yes, yes. So boats are great. Not usually the best tax strategy. But the big thing here is when you sail a boat or when you drive a car, I heard this the other day and I thought it was perfect. It's like when you drive a car, what's bigger, the windshield or the rear view mirror? Most people are doing taxes in the rear view mirror. That is not about your expansive future. That's about recording your past, right? And so if you just did business planning one year at a time,
Like you wouldn't ever buy the building. You wouldn't ever invest in the equipment. You wouldn't ever invest in the education, right? It's the same thing for taxes. It is part of a cohesive and ongoing plan. ? so when you want to plan that, we have to look into the future. And so looking into the future allows you to control your income, control your expenses. But you have to know your numbers to your point, right? Like if you don't understand a P &L,
It's really hard to do tax work because we don't know what your income is. And I have some clients who come in that way. And I have to really get them to understand that if you don't have good books, you don't have good data, it's like trying to do dentistry without a diagnostic. You just go in and start drilling teeth to see what's happening. No, you wouldn't do dentistry that way. Don't do that way with your taxes either. should I just buy this and I'll just buy that and randomly and I help those work out?
Your P &L is really like your diagnostic, right? Both on the income side, but also that's related to taxes. And so I think the big thing for people is think of taxes as an additional income stream. If you do this right, you can keep, like a lot of dentists pay 40 % or more in taxes, right? So if we can cut that from 40 down to 20 to 25 % on average, that's 15 % straight to your bottom line.
And it probably takes an average of two hours a month at most, which is pretty good, right? Like if you could add a new service into your business, no employees, no marketing, no overhead, two hours a month, but profits went up by 15%, would you take it? Most dentists would say, yeah, that six figures is pretty good.
The Dental A Team (10:53)
As long as I'm not going to jail, Derick,
I don't want to go to jail. That's my only line. Like, how is this legal? Because so many people talk about tax strategy and my line is I'm willing to live in the gray, I'm just not willing to go to jail. So how do you go from 40 to 20 that's legal and ethical?
Derick Van Ness (11:01)
you
Yeah, we don't want to go to jail.
Yeah, so there's two things. There are lots of little things. So research and development credits, which we'll get to in a minute, is one of those things. It's not little. I would call it a medium thing. For a lot of dentists, it's worth between $10, depending on the size of your clinic, $10,000 $50,000 a year. So it's sizable. And then there's all the pay your kids, cost segregation, salary and dividends, all that kind of stuff. And those things stack up. If you pay your kids right, then that can save you
The Dental A Team (11:21)
I agree, I would too.
Mm-hmm.
Derick Van Ness (11:40)
10, 15 grand if you're in a state where you can pay your state taxes and have a federal write-off that might save you 10, 15, 20 thousand dollars a year. Taking a salary, the proper salary versus dividends that might save you another 10 or 15 thousand. So these things start to stack up but when you're in that 500,000 plus tax bracket there are things like and I can't totally get into details because this is stuff for accredited investors and I don't know who the listeners are and all that but there are
Investments you can make that have big tax breaks, right? And that could be everything from energy types of things to short-term rentals, different types of real estate. There's a lot of different stuff, right? So that sort of depends on what's the life you want to build and aligning that. ? There are lots of charitable and donation type strategies where you can create some really big tax breaks. There's entity structuring, ? where you take your income and how you take your income matters.
So you can really layer all of this stuff and make huge chunks, take huge chunks out of your business. The bigger you are, the bigger you can do with these things. And honestly, once you get over a million plus in income, then there's another layer of stuff you can do. It's just a lot of times the setup costs, you have to have enough tax burden to make it worth it. But there's some really neat stuff out there. And some of the stuff with the big, beautiful bill. ?
bringing back bonus depreciation. There's some really neat things where, oh, if you do a solar thing, you can get some credits, but then you can also get all the depreciation in the first year. And so you put in $100,000 into this type of investment. You may not make a lot of money, but you might get $150,000, $175,000, $200,000 worth of write-offs on your taxes. And when I say write-offs, mean dollars you don't pay, like true credit dollar for dollar. That could be huge, right? Things like that.
The Dental A Team (13:10)
Yes.
Right.
Derick Van Ness (13:38)
that a lot of people are just unaware of. And don't take that as an investment advice. I'm just telling you about things that exist in the world that may or may not be for you. Check with your financial professional. But yeah, you start stacking all these things up and you go from, I wrote $150,000 check to, I wrote a $60,000 check. And then what I like to do is help people take that 90 grand you would have given to the government. And now let's add that to what you would already save. And for a lot of people, that's
The Dental A Team (13:47)
That's amazing.
Derick Van Ness (14:07)
a lot more than they were already saving. So we more than doubled their savings rate. And the fastest thing you can do to build wealth is just get more money into the equation. So that's really it is we're trying to create money that you can then put to work for you outside your business. Because what nobody ever tells you is, even if you're an amazing dentist and you make all this money and you sell your practice for top dollar, and you get all that money, you become a professional investor.
The Dental A Team (14:27)
you
Derick Van Ness (14:36)
And if you don't have any investment skills, if you don't know how to put that money to work, if you don't know how to protect it, you're just a lamb to the slaughter. You know, everybody shows up, they got an idea. Your brother-in-law wants to start a coffee shop or a brewery. Your neighbor has the next best tech app. And all of a sudden, all this money just starts disappearing because you're not seasoned. So one of the things we like to do is get people doing these types of investments, learning, getting a skill set around it so that when you do get that big
big shot when you sell your business or you have those huge tax or those huge years and you don't pay all the taxes, you know what to do with the money. Because that's a whole different skill set than running a dental clinic.
The Dental A Team (15:17)
I don't disagree. And that's why Derick, I love having you on here. And I think your comment of the goal is to get more money to put into the equation. What are the things like, I have 90 grand or I have 150. What are some of those investments that, again, realize that we're being generic and there's a reason you have to be generic is because there are rules that financial planners, advisors, CPAs have to abide by. in general terms, Derick, what are some of the ways that
Derick Van Ness (15:25)
Mm-hmm.
The Dental A Team (15:45)
you found to generate higher levels of wealth? We're putting more money into the equation, but what's the equation that's going to get it? And again, I know this is very, I would say like vanilla. We're just talking very much basic.
Derick Van Ness (15:56)
Yeah, yeah, I'll just
give you the principles, right? The philosophy behind it. One of the things is we always, all of our lives we've heard diversify your assets. Diversify, diversify, diversify.
The Dental A Team (16:06)
all weather portfolio, Ray Dalio, right? Like you got to get it everything, have it all. What is it like? think eight uncorrelated assets or something like that is what it should be. Anyway, there you go. Okay.
Derick Van Ness (16:09)
Yep.
8 to 16 non-correlated asset
classes. Yep. And the idea here is this. It used to be that you could put your money in the stock market. And each individual stock did its thing based on what its performance was. Since the late 90s, early 2000s, everything's kind of gotten grouped together. Almost everybody just buys the S &P 500 or just buys index funds, which is basically the whole market.
And so if you look at the top five stocks, which are usually the Google, Apple, Tesla, Nvidia, depending on one or two others, ? whatever they're doing is usually what the market's doing, right? It all has a tendency to ebb and flow together because it's all been chunked together. So I don't see those all as different asset classes anymore. How I personally invest, I'm not saying you need to buy into my ideas, but so you can have money there. But then I do think you want to have money in other things.
that maybe aren't tied to the stock market. Maybe you've got some oil and gas. Maybe you've got some farming communities in Central America. Maybe you've got someone who's doing senior living homes, someone who's developing all these empty office buildings. And they're all tied to different things. So that way, if the stock market takes a dump and goes down, that's not all your portfolio. Maybe it's 15 or 20%.
if real estate takes a hit. Yeah, your real estate takes a hit, but maybe something else does well. Having things in your portfolio that if some of them struggle during inflation, some of them do well during inflation, right? Things like gold that holds its value. And so the idea is to be able to put your money to work in a way where it's in a bunch of different buckets that aren't all tied to the same thing. And what that really creates is stability, right? And why that's so important is when you're growing your money,
The Dental A Team (17:46)
Mm-hmm.
Derick Van Ness (18:09)
You can have the ups and downs a little bit, but when you go to start pulling money out, the volatility, the ups and downs are what really kill your ability to pull money out, because you have to always protect against the downside. And it's why if you look at the market historically, it'll go up, depending on who you ask, 6 to 8%. But when you're pulling money out of the stock market in retirement, the numbers say sustainably over the long term, you can only pull 3 to 4%. Why is that? You would think, ? I can pull.
The Dental A Team (18:21)
Mm-hmm.
Right.
Derick Van Ness (18:38)
six to eight, but it's three to four because of the volatility. If you are counting on that, it crashes that year and you sell. Then when the market recovers, you have less money to recover with. And over time that stacks up. So the idea there is to work with someone who has the ability to put you into different asset classes, help educate you. This also gives you a chance to try different things. So you can start to get that seasoning we were talking about and learn how money really works because
The Dental A Team (18:43)
Right.
Derick Van Ness (19:09)
You know, money, health and relationships are the three things that really dictate the quality of your life. And it's funny, we don't spend a lot of time in them in school, right? And so, ? so it's something you have to learn, just like if you don't learn how to take care of your health, you suffer. If you don't learn how to have good relationships, you suffer. And money is another thing. All of those you can get help with, but at the end of the day, you have to be able to be competent enough.
to get the results you want. And money is just one of those things.
The Dental A Team (19:40)
Yeah. No, Derick, that's a, think it's such a good way to look at it. And I will say, I was very much a baby investor and I think I still would qualify myself as pretty naive. But it is, they say like, I don't know, what is it? The eighth wonder of the world is compound interest. And it's crazy because when you start out and you just get started on your investments, it feels like this is stupid. At least I have, I've so told many financial advisors, feel like they like,
Derick Van Ness (20:04)
Mm.
The Dental A Team (20:07)
money monster. So it's like the cookie monster. Like I give my money to you. I never can get it back. I have no clue how to access this money. And then you start to see it and you're like, wow, that started to compound and this started to become different. And we had our first year with it. We didn't have to write such a large check to the IRS and done legally and ethically. And I was like, wow, this is a very different world that I'm living in than I have been. And it wasn't as hard as I thought. And so I, like you said, I do feel like you're
Derick Van Ness (20:11)
Yeah.
The Dental A Team (20:33)
comfort level and they do say that women tend to be better investors than men because women, we just put money in, we give it to you. We're like, here you go. We don't ever like go check it and watch the stocks. Stocks. Whereas men are like, cons I'm like looking at those stocks, like my husband checks it like 10 times a day. And I'm like, just don't even look at it. Like I don't even, it's the cookie monster, the money monster. You take the money. I know you haven't like taken it. People get angry with me. They're like, Kiera, we can't legally take your money. And I'm like, no, but I just have no clue how to access it. They're like you email. And I'm like, I know.
Derick Van Ness (20:44)
Right.
Yep. In your brain, right?
The Dental A Team (21:02)
but it like stocks and then I got to pay taxes and I don't understand any of it. But I will say, I think it's like PNLs, the language of money, the language of investing. It's a skill that you are learning. And I do agree, the younger you can learn this, the more time you have to recover if you make mistakes and versus having to be perfect later on in life. So I really very much subscribe to your model of thinking. And I love that. I love that you've talked about taxes, how to save, how to get it into
Derick Van Ness (21:11)
Mm-hmm.
The Dental A Team (21:31)
Again, I remember I sat in a Tony Robbins wealth mastery thing. Ray Dalio was in the room. had no clue who half like Paul Tudor Jones. I think that's his name. Like so freaking smart. I had no clue who these people were. And like here you've got like five billionaires sitting in the room with us. And I was like, I had no clue. And they start talking about this stuff. And I feel like an idiot, but I will say it's an idiot that I love to be because the more I learn about the more I'm involved in it, the more you expose yourself, the more you learn how it works.
Derick Van Ness (21:38)
John Paul Tudor, yeah.
Yeah, I remember.
The Dental A Team (22:00)
And I think like what you're saying, Derick, I just hope people talk to your financial advisors, get your uncorrelated assets, start building that portfolio because time, like they say, you only have so much time and the best time to plant a tree was like a hundred years ago. The next best time is today. And I just, I don't want to be that person when it comes to my portfolio where I wish I would have started. All of us will wish we started sooner, but I am grateful that we started as young as we were and are building it the way we have versus
Derick Van Ness (22:23)
Yes.
The Dental A Team (22:28)
waiting until like, and I don't care if you haven't started then start today. If you've been doing it, figure out how you can do more. ? But I think Derick, I have a question of, I always live in scarcity. So what do you tell a client like myself where I'm always afraid that I'm going to run out of money. I don't know where it comes from. It doesn't matter how much I have. I have acorns upon acorns upon acorns. I swear like you've probably can find money in my couch. I'm not that bad. I don't have it in the couch, but like,
Derick Van Ness (22:32)
Yep.
The Dental A Team (22:54)
How do you get to a level where you feel comfortable spending money rather than just always saving for retirement and not living today? What's the balance of that?
Derick Van Ness (23:03)
Yeah, so what I've discovered working with over 2,500 people on all of this, Kiera, is like money problems don't like quote unquote go away. They just change. In the beginning, it's like, how do I make money? I don't have enough money. How do I manage the car payment or whatever? Then you make a little bit more and you're like, okay, now I'm past survival. Like, how do I start to grow? Right? So you invest in yourself, your business, your education, whatever. Then you start to grow some more.
Then you start saying, okay, now I'm growing and I'm making money and I'm living a decent life, but how do I build for the future? So it's not just the now, then it's the future, right? And then what happens is you definitely get to a point, at least I've seen this for myself and a lot of clients is you start to make a good amount of money and the problem becomes how do I make sure that this doesn't ever go away?
Right? Like now I'm living this really good life and I can travel and I can spend time with family and I can do the things that I want to do. And I can buy nice clothes or go to nice dinner or do nice things for my kids or whatever your thing is. And I don't have to think about money. But then there's this fear of like, what if I lose that? Right. And going back. And so the money problems just change. I believe it's an instinct that's built into us. Like the monkeys that ate bananas and then just stopped worrying and didn't hoard them.
ended up dying faster than the ones that hoarded them, right? And so, like, I think it's an instinct to be paranoid, to be fear-driven, and that's where we have to, as humans, understand our wiring and say, my wiring is for survival, not for happiness and fulfillment, right? Because survival is what reproduced. Happiness and fulfillment, especially in a scary world of survival, ? doesn't do very well.
The Dental A Team (24:27)
Sure.
Derick Van Ness (24:52)
Right? So, so we have to try to rewire our brain as much as we can. ? And I think the biggest thing is to focus on a big future, a big vision. When you're moving towards something, then you're not focused on moving away from something. When you're in fear, you're, moving away from something. I'm moving away from failure. I'm moving. I'm trying to avoid losing money. I'm trying to avoid running out, trying to avoid making a mistake. You know, this about business ownership, like you can't avoid the mistakes. You just try and minimize them.
and learn from them as fast as you can. Like making mistakes is part of success and nobody says it that way, but I think it's really, really important to get that. And when you're moving towards something, you're in abundance, you're in striving, you're in goal oriented, whatever your thing is. And that doesn't have to be about money. That could be, I wanna be a great parent. I wanna get in better health. I wanna have more free time and make the same money.
So this isn't like just a money conversation, but when you're moving toward those, you have a tendency to lose your fear. I think it's when we aren't sure where to go next that we get afraid of losing ground and we do that. And so I think sometimes it's just a matter of clarity and reminding yourself, where do I want to go? What am I building? Like once you get past a certain point, like, you know, once you get past a certain amount of income or a certain amount of wealth, it's not about money anymore.
Right. It's really about contribution. It's about impact. And I think when we, our mind can really only focus on one thing at a time, especially as men, ? women are much better at seeing the big picture. ? But, but really when you're focused on something that holds your attention and then it doesn't drift to some of the other stuff as much, it doesn't mean you won't. Cause I'll tell you, I'm at my most vulnerable when I wake up in the morning and my brain starts doing payroll and all these other things. And like you said,
The Dental A Team (26:26)
you
Derick Van Ness (26:47)
I have enough cash stored away that I could not make a dollar for a year and still pay for my whole business and do the whole thing and be fine. But that doesn't mean that that instinctual part of me doesn't freak out for a minute until I come in and say, hey, we're building massive things. We're changing people's lives. Let's just focus on that and let the rest take care of itself. That really is the best thing for me is to focus on where I'm going, not where I'm afraid I might end up.
The Dental A Team (27:15)
Absolutely. I
think that was good. Good wisdom there. You are the person, if you guys have heard me talk about it on the podcast, this came from Derick. He's the one who's told me it's a return on emotion, not necessarily a return on investment and like what helps you sleep at night, what helps you stay there. And I love that you talked about like it is a survival instinct. It's not a bad instinct. so loving that side, but also tempering it so that way we can enjoy the fulfillment. And again, I also think that there becomes confidence in yourself. I think enough.
enough business crashes, enough mistakes, enough things where you come back from it also teach you that there's certainty within yourself that no matter what comes your way, ? you know that you'll be able to survive it, you'll be able to come. Someone told me once, it's not unsafe, it's just uncomfortable. Unless someone's running at you with like a knife and it's truly life threatening, it's like if the stock market crashes, that's like we're still safe, it's just going to be pretty dang uncomfortable for a little bit. If we become bankrupt,
Derick Van Ness (27:47)
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
The Dental A Team (28:13)
We're not unsafe, we're just uncomfortable. And that has given me a lot of, I think, temperance on when you think about finances, like that'd be uncomfortable, but I am still safe and I would still be alive and we can come back and we can figure things out. So Derick, I know we wanted to pivot gears and talk R &D credits, because this is something that's new. yeah, let's kind of chat that because I think we've gone through tax strategy, building wealth mindset around ? how to maintain and have that.
Derick Van Ness (28:30)
Well, yeah, we'll keep it short here.
The Dental A Team (28:42)
return on emotion and building those skills. And I really love that you just said money issues don't ever go away, they just change shape. And I think that that's the same as business, right? Business problems just become a different flavor and different color. ? But now let's talk about like some R &D credits because we've talked about R &D. I've seen several clients do very well on R &D credits. So was excited to hear like, they're back and they're back again, and they look a little different. So I'm excited to hear if you guys don't know what they are, Derick will definitely explain them and how you can.
Derick Van Ness (29:02)
Yep.
The Dental A Team (29:08)
Dental practices are ripe for the picking of R &D, it's exciting to have a resource for dental practices.
Derick Van Ness (29:15)
Yeah, dental practices really are because the R &D credits are designed when you do new things in your business that are based in technology. And that could be computer science, engineering, biological science, or physical science, like chemistry, ? which dentists are doing all of that stuff. So when you do new stuff in your business, the government realizes you're taking a risk. You're trying a new implant system. You're trying a new ?
a new type of diagnostic, you're trying a new flow for your patients, whatever. Sometimes it blows up in your face. I everybody listening here has tried a new piece of software and after six weeks you wanted to throw the computer out the window and you're like, we're going back to the other one, we got to find something else, right? ? Or we tried 3D printing and it was just really, really hard and like some people love it, some people hate it. But at the end of the day, every time you take that risk, the government knows that you could lose money.
The Dental A Team (29:57)
Totally.
Derick Van Ness (30:11)
So the R &D credits are really their effort to say, don't stop innovating. Don't stop trying to get better. We know you're going to take some skin, knees, and elbows along the way. And we're willing to give you some credits to help with that. so ? dentists, like dentistry is moving so fast. I don't have to tell the listeners that. There's new stuff every single quarter, every single year. Five years ago, everybody was getting crowns to be milled. Now they're 3D printing teeth and doing all, you know.
digital scans and all the other stuff and pretty quick here, think we have robots doing surgery. I don't necessarily want to be the first person to try that, but.
The Dental A Team (30:45)
Yeah, me neither. I'm like number
like 200,000. I'll try it at that point. I'm usually like number two jumping off a cliff if the first person's alive, then I'll jump. Unlike innovative robots, I only have 28 teeth left, so I'll just let them practice a bit more before they come to me. It's okay. Stick with the drill and fill. Yeah, the drill and fill, I'm okay with it. It's all right. It's better.
Derick Van Ness (30:51)
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yep.
I'll just pay a little more for the people.
Yes. so effectively, most dentists just don't realize they're qualifying for these credits. And so what we try to help them do is we do a free estimate to help you understand, OK, let's go through the different things that you did in your practice. It takes maybe a half an hour to identify the different things you've done. And right now, there's a window. And this is why we wanted to talk about this today, that closes on the 4th of July of 2026. So we've got about three or four months left.
where you can go back and you can file for 2022, 2023, and 2024. I don't want to bore everybody, but effectively when they did the 2017 tax rewrite, the first Trump tax rewrite, it broke the R &D credits in 2022. You could file for them, but the downside was bigger than the upside, so it wasn't worth doing. Now, they kind of did that on purpose to balance the budget, and they thought, oh, we'll change it before 2022, and then COVID happened, so they never changed it.
So it got broken. So they came back and they fixed it and said, hey, you guys can go back and claim this, but you really only have until the 4th of July. So they gave us one year to do it. ? And so it's a big opportunity, a big window right now where you can get three years worth of credit. So you can literally go back. The government will send you a check for taxes you've overpaid, and you can get that money back. I won't tell you the IRS is really fast at processing this stuff, but they do get to all of them.
The Dental A Team (32:23)
Wow.
No.
Derick Van Ness (32:34)
And the checks come in, and we've done over 1,000 of these for clients. So it's definitely a legit thing. And the credits have been around since the 80s. They became a permanent part of the tax code in 2015. So they were kind of new. They've been around about 10 years. But the first couple of years, nobody knew. then over the last couple of years, they've become more and more popular. But then they kind of screwed them up in 22 through 24. So the reason I wanted to talk about them is if somebody is a dentist, they're not claiming these credits. But they are doing.
The Dental A Team (32:38)
Wow.
Derick Van Ness (33:04)
Innovative things upgrading equipment trying new software trying new techniques new implant systems new Diagnostics, whatever you probably got all these credits sitting there. You don't know about and It's worth getting a free estimate to see what's on the table. Yes You do have to amend your taxes, which is a very small pain in the butt But your total time into this should be an hour or two, which is really a short conversation You send over tax returns ? A team like ours would give you an estimate
And if it seems like it's worth doing it, then you do it. You just let them do their thing and you write the check for the fee, right? So it's pretty hard to beat bang for your buck hour for hour. And like I said, for a lot of practices, it's between 1 to 2 % of your gross revenue. This is not a quote. This is just like what I've generally seen. So if you have a million dollar practice, it's probably 10 to 20 grand a year if you're doing these types of things. I mean, I have some. We just did a doctor who's got
Six offices they're getting almost a half a million dollars back right it can be it can be major and Doesn't take him any longer than to take someone with one office so you know it's it's just a big window of opportunity that I wanted to try and squeeze in here and People who haven't done this or unaware. It's like hey, we got a big opportunity and you can do this for 2025 moving forward every year. It's it's back indefinitely and so my hope is
The Dental A Team (34:07)
It's incredible.
Derick Van Ness (34:32)
People can do the catch up. And then from here forward, you don't even have to amend. You just party your tax return. You just don't pay the taxes. Just like you depreciate equipment or anything else and just get the tax break, the difference is tax credits are dollar for dollar. So if you get $10,000 tax credit, it's just $10,000 you don't pay in taxes, not a $10,000 write off, which might be worth $3,000 or $4,000.
The Dental A Team (34:40)
awesome.
Mm-hmm.
Totally. No, and I think Derick, I'm so glad you brought this up. And at first I was creeped out by you. I'm not going to lie. Like when you first started talking about it, was like, are these like, I don't know, what are they called? The opportunity zones. And like, I heard a lot of people got their shorts burned on those. And I was like, do I even put this on the podcast? But I will say, Derick just said he's done thousands of them. They have had great success. I have seen clients tell me, thank you. So that's why I wanted Derick to come on because any client that comes from Dental A Team does get preferred.
Derick Van Ness (35:03)
you
huh.
The Dental A Team (35:26)
I don't know treatment. don't know what you guys do, but I do know that there's, ? you guys get, you just said you get pushed to the front of line. If you mentioned you heard on Dental A Team podcast, we also have a link with big life financial. I'm pretty sure Derick, if I remember right, I'm pretty sure we do. ? but definitely wanted you guys to have that, especially with a closing in July. And it's something where I love that Derick will just like, he's met with me and my husband several times to talk about multiple things. Derick is non pushy. And I appreciate that about you, Derick. You ? educate.
Derick Van Ness (35:27)
Treatment, yep, yep, front of the line.
We do. Yep.
The Dental A Team (35:56)
and then give people the information and then you're to make the decisions on your own. So I think like, why not? Why not reach out to Derick? Why not just like see what it looks like? And then you have their resources. They're not going to file unless you want them to. You don't have to break up with your CPA if they file for you. I'm pretty sure. Is that right? Like you don't have to switch.
Derick Van Ness (36:09)
Correct.
No, no, yeah,
you don't have to. We can amend it for you. But in a lot of cases, it makes sense to just have your CPA do it. They've got all your information. So but we can handle it either way.
The Dental A Team (36:25)
So I think like on that, I just feel it's very much worthwhile. And I know Big Life Financial does a lot. do. I'll let you like take it because I know you guys are added to more services. But I think like if nothing else, we want to have the call to action of like, just look into the R &D credits. Like I said, I have seen multiple checks go to practices. They have not been audited. ? Things have gone very smoothly for them. I was skittish. But I mean, Derick, we've been talking about this, I don't know, almost five years now, if not longer, that we've been telling practices about it. So.
Derick Van Ness (36:52)
Yep.
The Dental A Team (36:54)
very excited, but Derick, kind of tell about the makeup of what Big Life Financial is and then how people can reach out to you, especially in particular to the R &D credits.
Derick Van Ness (37:04)
Yeah, so for the R &D credits, just go to, it's just BigLifeFinancial.com So BigLifeFinancial.com/DAT D-A-T right? Dental A Team. And all you got to do is just set up a time there to talk with myself or someone on my team. It's like a 15 minute call. And we'll just screen it, see if it makes sense. Beyond that, we do offer full service taxes if for some reason you're looking for tax breaks or you feel like you're, for one reason or another, you need to make a change.
then we can do that. We do also work with an RIA. So if you're looking for some of these investments that might have tax breaks or other diversification or whatever, we have those capabilities as well. So we really try to be front to back like what we call like a family office or a fractional family office, which is what the super rich people have. They just have an attorney and a CPA and a
Uh, an insurance guy, an investment guy, or probably 10 investment guys who all just work for them. Obviously most people can't afford to have an entire team that just works for them. So we work with a limited number of people, but we have a coordinated team that way. And, and it's taken me like 10 years to find the right people to do that. That's, that's really it because the Uber wealthy have those people, the people who are making 50 or a hundred thousand bucks a year, they don't need it. We really work in this sweet spot where a lot of people make.
300,000 400,000 on the low end to 2 3 million on the high end. And they're kind of in between, not rich enough to have the team that's all working together all the time, but rich enough that you really need it. Like this segment of the population is the one that just gets crushed on taxes. ? And so we're really doing our best to help minimize that. So that's why we work so much with dentists and doctors.
The Dental A Team (38:56)
That's amazing. I love that Derick. And I think for everybody, it was BigLifeFinancial.com slash DAT. We'll be sure to like link that in the show notes and also add it for you guys. But, and Derick, love, I didn't know what a family office was at first. And then I found out hanging out with a lot of wealthy people, what it is. And so for you to provide that, think worth conversations ? and definitely appreciate the insights today. It was a really fun episode. I'm glad we got back together. It's been too long. ? And like truly guys, just reach out.
Again, I would do it as exploration. would do it as like, just find out anytime I hear things like this, I just go book meetings. It doesn't mean I need to actually execute on it. But I think again, learning the language of business, learning the education, seeing if it fills right for you. Now you can ask a million people, but like I said, Derick and I have been doing this for about five years and every client that has been referred to Big Life Financial has gone through, has told me how much they've been grateful for it. So Derick, I appreciate you. Any last wrap up thoughts today as we wrap up today? I appreciate our time so much today together.
Derick Van Ness (39:55)
No, I think it's just understanding that part of building wealth is beyond just making income, right? Just making income won't build the life you want to live. Once you earn the money, you got to take care of it. And there's a lot of pieces to that. So whether it's with us or someone else, just take that on for your family's sake. It's not just about making it. It's keeping it and being smarter with it. And if you do that, you're going to be in good hands.
The Dental A Team (40:20)
amazing. Well, Derick, thank you so much for being here today. Thank you all for listening. I love what Derick said, like it's not just enough to make the money, we need to figure out how to keep the money and set yourselves up for the great lives that you've been building and to truly have that big life as Derick has described it. So for all of you listening, I hope that today you don't just passively listen, but you actively take action and commit to having the wealth of your life, the wealth of your dreams to have that life that really ?
is the life of your dreams. there's a quote from my mirror from when I was little where I said, don't just dream, do. And I think that that's how I'll leave you today. So for all of you listening, thank you for listening and we'll catch you next time on the Dental A Team Podcast.